Question
How did Socrates influence the Stoics?
See how Epictetus treats Socrates as the model of a person who has mastered judgment, dialogue, and fear of death.
Updated
The short answer
Epictetus makes Socrates the concrete proof of Stoic claims rather than a distant hero. Socrates shows that death is not inherently terrible, since it did not appear terrible to him, that sound argument works by drawing out an opponent's own contradictions rather than ridiculing him, and that a person's judgment can remain untouched even by a death sentence. For Epictetus, becoming a Stoic means aiming to become a Socrates.
Key points
- Epictetus uses Socrates as evidence that death is not terrible in itself, since it did not appear terrible to him, and that our disturbance comes from judgment, not the event.
- Epictetus credits Socrates with a method of argument that draws contradictions out of an opponent's own admissions rather than mocking or lecturing him.
- The line from Plato's Crito and Apology, that his accusers can kill him but cannot hurt him, is recommended by Epictetus as a maxim to keep ready for real threats.
- Epictetus tells his students to live as people desiring to become a Socrates, making him a working standard for personal progress, not a figure to simply admire.
The longer answer
Epictetus does not treat Socrates as a distant historical figure. He treats him as the working example of what Stoic theory is trying to produce: a person whose judgments are sound enough that nothing external can shake him. Three things stand out in how Socrates is used: his verdict on death, his method of argument, and his conduct when he was actually killed.
Death is not terrible, Socrates proves it
The Handbook opens its most famous psychological claim with Socrates as the test case. Men are disturbed not by things but by their judgments about things, and death is not terrible, else it would have appeared so to Socrates (Handbook 5). The logic is simple. If death were bad in itself, it would look bad to everyone, including the wisest man available. Since Socrates did not treat it as terrible, the terror is not in death but in our notion of death. This is the cognitive core of Stoic ethics, and Epictetus reaches for Socrates to make it concrete rather than argue it in the abstract.
A method, not just a mood
Epictetus also credits Socrates with a specific way of arguing, described in the Discourses. Rather than lecturing an opponent or mocking him for ignorance, Socrates used the conclusions his adversary already held and drew out their contradictions, so that the man saw the problem for himself and withdrew from it (Discourses II 12). Epictetus's example is envy: Socrates gets his interlocutor to admit that the envious man is pained, not pleased, and then to admit that this pain is felt over good things, not evils, exposing envy as a confused judgment about what is good. Epictetus contrasts this with how his own students handle an untrained opponent, who they often just ridicule instead of guiding, and says a philosopher should act as a guide who leads a man back onto the road rather than abandoning him on it (Discourses II 12). Socrates is the model for how philosophical conversation is supposed to work: not winning, but exposing a false judgment so plainly that the other person sees it too.
Constancy under threat
Among the maxims Epictetus recommends keeping ready at hand is a line drawn straight from Plato: Crito, if it thus pleases the gods, thus let it be, Anytus and Melitus may kill me indeed, but hurt me they cannot (Handbook 53). Socrates accepts his death sentence without treating his accusers as capable of harming what actually matters, his character. That is the dichotomy of control in a single sentence, applied at the moment it costs the most.
The popular misreading
It would be easy to read all this as Epictetus simply admiring Socrates, the way people today admire a hero. That is not what is happening. Epictetus tells his students that Socrates became perfect by improving himself in everything, attending to nothing but reason, and then adds the demand: though you are not yet a Socrates, you ought to live as one desirous of becoming a Socrates (Handbook 51). Socrates is not a legend to praise from a distance. He is the standard against which your own procrastination is measured. The chapter's real subject is the reader's own delay, the habit of always finding one more day before you finally attend to yourself, and Socrates is introduced precisely to remove the excuse that no such standard exists.
What this changes
If Socrates is evidence that judgment, not fortune, decides whether death or accusation can hurt you, then admiring him is not enough. The Stoic use of Socrates asks you to treat his verdicts as testable claims about your own mind: is what disturbs you really the event, or your opinion of it. One concrete practice follows directly from Handbook 53: keep a short line like Socrates's own ready in advance, so that when a real threat to your reputation or safety arrives, you already have a judgment on hand that refuses to call it harm to what is truly yours.
Primary passages
Thus Socrates became perfect, improving himself by everything. Attending to nothing but reason. And though you are not yet a Socrates, you ought, however, to live as one desirous of becoming a Socrates.
Epictetus, Handbook 51 Read in context
Epictetus makes Socrates the working standard of Stoic progress, not a figure to admire from a distance.
Men are disturbed, not by things, but by the principles and notions which they form concerning things. Death, for instance, is not terrible, else it would have appeared so to Socrates. But the terror consists in our notion of death that it is terrible.
Epictetus, Handbook 5 Read in context
Socrates serves as living proof of the Stoic claim that judgments, not events, disturb us.
Oh Crito, if it thus pleases the gods, thus let it be. Anytus and Melitus may kill me indeed, but hurt me they cannot.
Epictetus, Handbook 53 Read in context
Epictetus recommends this line from Plato's Crito and Apology as a maxim to keep ready, showing Socrates's constancy under a real death sentence.
How then did Socrates act? He used to compel his adversary in disputation to bear testimony to him, and he wanted no other witness. Therefore he could say, 'I care not for other witnesses, but I am always satisfied with the evidence (testimony) of my adversary
Epictetus, Discourses II 12 Read in context
Epictetus treats Socrates's method of argument, drawing out an opponent's own commitments, as a model for how a philosopher should reason with others.
Now a guide, when he has found a man out of the road leads him into the right way: he does not ridieule or abuse him and then leave him. Do you also show the illiterate man the truth, and you will see that he fellows.
Epictetus, Discourses II 12 Read in context
Epictetus draws a practical lesson from Socrates for how to treat someone who is wrong, guide rather than mock.
Important distinctions
Admiring Socrates versus using him as a standard
It is easy to treat Socrates as a legendary figure worth praising from a distance. Epictetus does the opposite. In Handbook 51 he moves straight from Socrates's example to a demand on the reader: you are not yet a Socrates, but you should live as one who wants to become one. The point of naming Socrates is to remove excuses for your own delay, not to admire someone else's achievement.
Winning an argument versus exposing a judgment
Epictetus distinguishes ridiculing an untrained opponent from guiding him. Socrates's method, described in Discourses II 12, is not about defeating an adversary in debate. It is about using the adversary's own commitments to make a false judgment visible to him, so that he withdraws from it himself.
Objections and replies
Is this really Socrates, or Epictetus's Socrates?
The Socrates who appears in the Handbook and Discourses is filtered through Epictetus's own concerns, the dichotomy of control and the discipline of judgment. A reader might object that this is a Stoicized Socrates, shaped to fit doctrines he never held in those terms.
That is a fair caution, and it is worth naming rather than hiding. What can be said on the evidence here is narrower and more solid: Epictetus explicitly draws on Socrates's recorded words in Plato's Crito and Apology and on stories about his method of argument, and uses them to anchor claims he is making about judgment and death. Whether Epictetus's reading matches Plato's own Socrates in full is a separate question from what Epictetus himself does with the figure.
Practice this in Stoa
Guided courses in the Stoa app that put this into daily practice.
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Podcast discussions
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Michael Trombley and Caleb on Emily Wilson's Critique of Epictetus
Michael Trombley and Caleb examine classicist Emily Wilson's three criticisms of Epictetus and test whether they hold up against the Discourses and Handbook.
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The Stoics vs. Plato: Blank Slate or Innate Ideas
Michael Tremblay and Caleb Ontiveros compare the Stoic view of the mind as a blank slate with Plato's theory of innate knowledge, and what each means for self-knowledge.
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Racine's Tragedies and the Failure of Stoic Self-Mastery
Peter Adamson explores how Jean Racine's tragedies stage the defeat of reason by passion, against the backdrop of Jansenism and a critique of Stoic and Cartesian optimism.
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Lani Watson on What Makes Something a Question
Lani Watson talks with Nigel Warburton about defining questions by function rather than form, and what happens when a culture stops asking them.
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Sappho on Eros, Beauty, and the Socratic Connection
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Related concepts, philosophers and works
Sources
- Epictetus, Discourses II Primary text, Stoa library
- Epictetus, Handbook Primary text, Stoa library